Re: Children of Joan (Joanna) of England and Llewelyn ap Iorwerth
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In reply to:
Children of Joan (Joanna) of England and Llewelyn ap Iorwerth
Marilyn Bauer 6/11/09
The question of who the mother of Gwladys Du (Dark-eyed) was is not exactly clear-cut. But a good number of sources specifically say she was the daughter of Joan, illegitimate daughter of King John. These include:
Cokayne, The Complete Peerage, Vol. IX, p. 276
J. Davies, A History of Wales, 1993, p. 140
D. Carpenter, The Minority of Henry III, 1990, p. 423
A.J. Roderick, Marriage and Politics in Wales, 1066-1282, Welsh History Review 4, 1968/69, p. 1
Sanders, English Baronies, 1963, p. 98-9 note 7
Chronicon Adae de Usk, Ed: E. Thompson, 1904, p. 166
Louise J. Wilkinson, Joan, Wife of Llywelyn the Great, Thirteenth Century England X; Proceedings of the Durham Conference 2003, ed. Michael Prestwich., Richard Britnell, and Robin Frame, Boydell Press, 2005, p. 87, & notes 39-41
Llywelyn and Joan married c. 1204. While there is no date of birth for Gwyladus, she married the first time in c. 1215. This would allow her to be at most 13 years old at the time. This is very young, but not completely unheard of. This assumes the dates for her mother’s marriage and her marriage are correct.
Four children have a number of sources showing them to be Joan’s. These are Elen, Margaret, Gwladus, and Dafydd. Other lists show other daughters. Besides Richardson’s whom you mentioned, showing a Susanna, one list show another daughter Anghard while still another shows the fifth child to be Gwenllian.
Llywelyn had a second son, Gruffydd ap Llywelyn, whose mother was Tangwystyl. He was apparently older than Dafydd because in 1222 a dispensation was granted disinheriting Gruffyd and making Dafydd, Llywelyn’s son by Joan the heir.
Jim
More Replies:
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Re: Children of Joan (Joanna) of England and Llewelyn ap Iorwerth
Isabelle Zimmer 7/02/09
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Re: Children of Joan (Joanna) of England and Llewelyn ap Iorwerth
Jim Fina 7/02/09
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Re: Children of Joan (Joanna) of England and Llewelyn ap Iorwerth
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Re: Children of Joan (Joanna) of England and Llewelyn ap Iorwerth
Marilyn Bauer 6/19/09