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Re: Maria Van Siclen Bible
Posted by: D G Van Curen (ID *****7681) Date: December 11, 2002 at 19:37:18
In Reply to: Re: Maria Van Siclen Bible by Ed Gusman of 69

"Doug continues NOT to be able to answer why Violetta would include the name of her grandmother on her application when no name was required.

Dough cannot explain why Violetta would write any name but the name of the great grandmother she had heard from her mother Fanny and uncle Ferdinand througout her life, whatever that name may have been, as opposed to Violetta allegedly conspiring with her mother and uncle to create a ficticious name.

If the great grandmothers name. which was the name of affidavit Cornelius's wife that Violetta had grown up hearing had been Hannah then Violetta would have written Hannah, if Annetje then Annetje would be on the application. The presence of Catherine Johnson on the affidavit is unequivocal proof that Catherine Johnson was the name Violetta had grown up hearing."
It has been explained satisfactorily, repeatedly. Its not my fault that you are incapable of comprehending even simple concepts. But I will try to make it even simpler, Eddy, just for your benefit.

Violetta read the name in a marriage record...passed the name became part of family folklore in 1906 - as Cornelius' "first wife". Fanny and Ferd accepted it because Violetta did the research. Their affadvits included the name "Catharine Johnson" not because they knew a Catharine Johnson, but because Violet said the marriage record identified her as Maria's mother. The fact that Maria's real mother was Hannah Lawson makes this scenario highly likely. Why would Fanny and Ferd use Hannah's name...the one they grew up with as grandmother...when Violetta had convinced them that she found evidence that Maria's mother was actually a Catharine Johnson", Cornelius' "First Wife". I challenge you to prove they knew their grandmother by the name "Catharine Johnson" before Violetta's research. They may have heard that name when they were children, because it was Maria's "step-great grand mother". Because the name was familiar, they may have accepted the "first wife" contention without question. She lived into the 1820s, so Maria may have known about her. But she was NOT Maria's mother. The only thing that the name "Catharine Johnson" being on the affadavit is unequivocal proof of, is that they repeated Violet's research error.

No one is impressed with your flag waving. The DAR application is essentially fiction, as are the affadavits. They have no real value in the world of genealogy research, except as examples of how fiction often times finds it way into family folklore. If you want to impress someone, spend your time searching for real records instead of wasting it trying to convince intelligent people that anyone related to you is incapable of making mistakes, therefore anything they say must be accepted without challenge. Real records have already proven you wrong. Everyone is still waiting for you to offer something concrete to show that you could possibly be right. And no, affadavits don't prove that affadavits are true. You have to come up with real records of your fantasy Cornelius' family, from the time the were alive. If they actually did exist, then there would be some record of their lives. Taxes, census, church, land...anything. The fact that you can't find anything tells everyone reading this just how reliable the affadavit information is.(NOT AT ALL) The affadavits are simply two pieces of paper containing claims that can not be verified or substantiated by any source documents of the time that Cornelius Van Sic(k)len was alive. Despite the oath, they are not proof of the life, service, or wife of Cornelius Van Sic(k)len - father of Maria. Real evidence tells us that Hannah Lawson was Maria's mother. Violetta's 1906 DAR application followed the 1907 affadavits tells us that Fanny and Ferd got the name from Violetta. Regardless of whether they thought that the grandmother they knew as Hannah was actually Catharine Johnson(Hannah as a nickname for Catharine), or if they thought that Cornelius was married to Catharine before he married Hannah, the fact remains that Hannah Lawson was Maria's mother. You may be selling Catharine Johnson, but everyone is buying Hannah Lawson.

Do your self...and everyone here...a favor by learning about "research". You would be amazed how much you can learn about your family by tracking down the records generated by their day to day lives. One DAR file is not the only source of information on the planet. Your real ancestors are in the just have to look.

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