Re: Which I1 Haplotype?
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In reply to:
Re: Which I1 Haplotype?
Justin McNeill 1/14/09
According to Family Tree's own guidelines, at the 24 marker level, a 25/25 or 24/25 match demonstrates relatedness in spite of a missing paper trail. A 23/25 match is "probably related", and a 22/24 match is probably NOT related. More discrepencies than that and it's a "no way" proposition.
At the 37 marker level, a 37/37 match is "very tightly" related. Only when the comparison degrades to a 33/37 match does it start to get "iffy". At 5 or more mis-matches it's a "no way". In other words, NOT related within thousands of years.
As with the 37 marker level, at the 43 marker level a perfect match or only one off indicates "tightly" related. Two or three off still indicates relatedness, while 4 mismatches is marginal and 5 or more is an indication of NOT related.
At the 67 marker level, a 67/67 match can again demonstrate relatedness in spite of a missing paper trail, but it takes 10 or more mismatches to fall into the NOT related category. In other words, a perfect 37/37 match _can_ fall so far apart at the 67 marker level as to be a "no way" indication. How likely that is in one specific comparison just happens to be a roll of dice that absolutely no one can predict.
Our surname project has two related groups that, following Family Tree's guidelines, are "very tightly" related within each group. The two groups, however, have enough mis-matches when compared against the other group at the 37 marker level that no one at Family Tree whom I've spoken with will say they are related at all!
In one group, we currently have two 66/67 matchs, two 67/67 matches, plus half a dozen additional 37/37 matches, some with excellent paper trails and some with only partial paper trails, one of which was one of the 4 who tested to 67 markers. No one in that group has more than 2 mis-matches when compared against the group profile.
In the other, slightly smaller group, we presently have two 67/67 matches, but no additional 37/37 matches. And no one in the group has more than one mis-match when compared against the group profile.
Interestingly, one of the 67/67 matches in each group has had their SNPs tested. The positive and negative SNP markers are absolutely identical for those two individuals, who, seperately, are members of the two "non-related" groups.
Which means that once upon a time, ancestors of both groups were, for all practical purposes, identical. Of course, depending on who you're talking to, that could have beenan estimated 18 to 35 _thousand_ years ago! Before the Last Glacial Maximum (LGM) when Ice Sheets covered virtually 95 percent of Scandinavia, all of Scotland, probably more than 80 percent of Ireland or a good 70 percent of England!
Your I haplogroup is judged to be somewhat younger, but it still reaches 'way beyond historical times to before the LGM, according to various scientists. I believe that there was still a great deal of dry land between Europe, the British Isles, and Scandinavia long before the people hunting over and inhabiting those areas were thought of as proto-German, proto-Viking, or even proto-Celtic! In this, I cannot help but wonder if Nordtveldt's work in seperating "viking" versus "anglo-saxon" components of the I haplogroup may not have sadly misled you, others, and possibly even him.
More Replies:
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Re: Which I1 Haplotype?
Justin McNeill 1/16/09
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Re: Which I1 Haplotype?
Elizabeth Ferguson 1/16/09
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Re: Which I1 Haplotype?
Justin McNeill 1/17/09
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Re: Which I1 Haplotype?
Elizabeth Ferguson 1/20/09
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Re: Which I1 Haplotype?
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Re: Which I1 Haplotype?
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Re: Which I1 Haplotype?